[INTRODUCTION]
[0:00:05] DC: It takes the right skills and the right innovation to design and manage meaningful print marketing solutions. Welcome to Podcasts From the Printerverse, where we explore all facets of print and marketing that create stellar communications and sales opportunities for business success. I’m your host, Deborah Corn, the Intergalactic Ambassador to the Printerverse. Thanks for tuning in. Listen long and prosper.
[EPISODE]
[0:00:31] DC: Hey, everybody. Welcome to Podcasts From the Printerverse. This is Deborah Corn, your Intergalactic Ambassador. We have a returning guest on the podcast today, based in New Zealand, Shane Golder brings over two decades of experience as the Managing Director of Cassette, where he has mastered the art of cultivating client relationships, driving innovation, and fostering growth for print. He’s also one of the founders of Print Tribe, a new online platform dedicated to empowering print sales professionals with insights, connections, and resources to thrive in a competitive market.
With a passion for collaboration and a mission to help the industry, Shane is cultivating a by-the-industry-for-the-industry community that welcomes print sales pros worldwide. Links to Print Tribe, Cassette, and the previous podcast I recorded with Shane are in the show notes. Welcome back, sir.
[0:01:36] SG: Hello. Thanks for having me. Great to be here.
[0:01:40] DC: In case anyone missed our last podcast, can you let everybody know a little more about you and the work you do at Cassette?
[0:01:49] SG: Yeah. I think you’ve covered it pretty well in that intro. I’m Shane. I am the Founder and Managing Director of Cassette. We’re based in Auckland, New Zealand. I think we mentioned it last time, about a couple of thousand miles from Australia, at the end of the earth. We’re a graphic design and print management business. We look after mainly more corporate clients. We like to look after international based clients with a small marketing team based here in New Zealand. We either take care of all their graphic design, or all their print and signage, or a mixture of both. We just try and be that one-stop shop for them. Yeah, it’s where we’ve found success with that target market, I suppose.
[0:02:31] DC: We discussed the actual market in New Zealand in our last podcast. What I’m interested to know is it’s November, have you assessed any trends from your customers and what they’re buying these days, what they’re interested in?
[0:02:47] SG: They’ve all just realized that Christmas is about six weeks away, seems to be what we’ve discovered with our clients. I don’t think there’s any major trends. Yeah, I think as long as you keep design clean and professional and that signage and stuff still, and printers delivered on time and on budget, I think we can keep them all pretty happy.
[0:03:07] DC: There’s a, let’s say, a movement in creating more awareness for the embellishment world here in the US and in Europe. Has that made its way down under, down under in New Zealand yet?
[0:03:23] SG: Well, we have a couple of clients being the Moët Hennessy brand. Obviously, Moët & Chandon and Veuve Clicquot and Dom Pérignon, they’re always looking for a lovely embellishment. We’ve also got a couple of other clients in that space. Yeah, they’re loving high-end papers, really clean embossing, really clean foiling. Yeah, we definitely get a bit of that. I suppose, we’re not seeing it as much in other clients, they’re not pushing it as much. Yeah, we definitely see that in the higher-end brands that are really trying to push out the boundaries, I suppose.
[0:03:58] DC: You’re not just the managing director, you’re also involved with sales and new business development. How would you define your sales philosophy and what core principles guide your approach?
[0:04:13] SG: The core principle that I’d say defines me would be people buy because you understand them, not because they understand you. We’re always trying to work out what problems they have that we can fix and not trying to just push them onto, this is how we work. It’s, how do you want to work? How would you like this in a perfect world? How will this work for you? I always like asking the question when we pick up a new client and 30 or 60 days if I was to ask you like, what made this great? What would you think you’d be saying? That’s always a great way to start that conversation. Yeah, yeah, that would be my whole philosophy on everything, I’d say.
[0:04:54] DC: Sometimes people don’t know that they’re having a problem until someone points it out that there’s a better way to do it, or buy it, or produce it, or design it. How do you handle those conversations?
[0:05:06] SG: I love to ask questions. It’s always based on questions. We find that the problem we solve most is we have – because they’re marketing managers of large, or directors, marketing directors of large organizations, but with a small team based here in New Zealand, they usually have to have their fingers in many different pies, whether or not that’s TVCs and print and signage and events and etc., etc. We always start asking questions around that, like do you have issues with your timelines? Do you have issues with things arriving on time to your events? We start there and then we let them elaborate.
Then you can start to figure out what their real problem is, but it’s usually something around that. I always go with questioning strategies to figure out exactly what their problem is. But that’s where we start, but that’s just because of the nature of the clients that we have. We’re pretty clearly defined on who our target market is, so we know that that’s their issue, I suppose.
[0:06:05] DC: Did you say TVC?
[0:06:08] SG: Yeah. Television commercials.
[0:06:10] DC: Oh, God. Okay. Television commercials.
[0:06:11] SG: Because they’re doing a bit of everything.
[0:06:13] DC: Oh, it makes total sense. I just didn’t understand the acronym. Okay. Well, I asked you those sales questions, because you have created a new platform, as I mentioned, in the introduction for sales professionals. Can you let everybody know what Print Tribe is, what inspired its creation and who is the team behind it?
[0:06:38] SG: Well, firstly, you inspired the creation. I did this podcast with you, I don’t know, was it was eight or nine months ago, and you encouraged me that some of what I was saying, you thought was of interested people. I think you have such a large platform that for you to say that just seemed like something that I should look into. I then co-founded it with my friend, Matthew Ross. The reason he’s involved is I think the weekend, or the Friday night after I got off the podcast with you, we were just having a quiet beer and a catch-up down at the local pub, and he said, “Hey, look, you should do this. This is something I think he agreed with you. I think this is something you could be good at.”
Matt has a background of working in business coaching and he’s worked with large organizations, like Gallup. He has a bit of a passion in that area. Because whatever reason, he’d already been looking at platforms that could work. He was like, “I think you should look into this.” Then the third part of it was, I think I mentioned on the previous podcast, I got really lucky when I first started in the print industry that a man by the name of Neville, who owned at the time, the largest privately owned print company in New Zealand took me under his wing and taught me everything he knew. It was such a great way to start in any industry. I think just trying to, as you said, I’ve been in this industry for 20 years now. I now run a successful business. It’s just trying to pass on that knowledge. But I also know that I don’t know everything and I’m not in all the markets around the world and there’s going to be little idiosyncrasy.
To create a community where everybody can add in their two cents and try and add knowledge and just – I’d love for a perfect world a young person to jump on and be able to just get the real basics of sales and print and all that in one place and go, “I think I can actually do this.”
[0:08:33] DC: I’m truly honored that I was even part of the conversation in you forming Print Tribe. Had you not told me right before we recorded, everyone’s ears probably would have been shot because I would have screamed, “What are you talking about?” Thank you so much for that. I’m really glad that you trusted in yourself that you actually had something to give to other people. That’s really what this platform is. You are giving back to everybody. Now, you sent me a link to register. It was a simple process. It didn’t cost any money. Can you tell everybody if Print Tribe is open to everyone, and are there any requirements at all to join?
[0:09:21] SG: Yeah, open to everybody. Completely free. We might start adding some paid things to cover my time at some stage. I have a, as I said, a successful business and Matt’s co-founder, he also is successful in what he does, so we don’t need to monetize it. It’s not a necessity. Yeah, it is just about giving back. All you need to do is give us an email address and come up with a simple password, which we don’t keep or anything. Yeah, we just really want to share as much knowledge as we can come up with. As we going to try and catch up weekly and just come up with new ideas of what we think could be helpful. We’d also just love for people that joined to tell us what they would like to see. You’ve already done that for me today before we jumped on the podcast, gave me a couple of pointers, and obviously, you have a super successful community. Yeah, happy to take advice. Yeah, it’s not about money for us at this stage.
[0:10:14] DC: Your membership is growing. I see some familiar faces, because people can create profiles and speak with each other, which is another thing that I think is what defines a community, versus this is a platform, and I own everybody on it type situation, right? Are you catering to salespeople in all stages of their careers? Are you targeting people already established who want to get further?
[0:10:43] SG: Well, I think everyone can get something out of it. I’d love for seasoned professionals definitely to pop on, even if it was also just to share knowledge. As I said, we’re not over the top of what’s happening in every single print market around the world, so to get a little bit of knowledge specific on the ground is always great to have. I think, yeah, it’d be great for a first-time salesperson to get on. I also think you can also get set in your ways as you get even become a medium level and then at a higher level as well. To get different ideas and bounce ideas around would be great.
I think the time I struggled most and I think I mentioned that some of the last podcast was probably when I was a few years in and you get a bit of experience and you get a bit of knowledge about print and then you start oversharing on your knowledge about print. As we said, the client doesn’t give a toss about that. Yeah, I think you can learn as a medium-level salesperson as well. I think you’d be a lot there.
[MESSAGE]
[0:11:42] DC: Are you looking to elevate your game, take your bottom-line customer relationships, and events to the next level? Then, I want to work with you. I’m Deborah Corn, the Intergalactic Ambassador to the Printerverse. I engage with a vast, global audience of print and marketing professionals across all stages of their careers. They are seeking topical information and resources, new ways to serve their customers and connect with them, optimize processes for their communications and operations, and they need the products and services and partnership you offer to get to their next level.
Print Media Centr offers an array of unique opportunities that amplify your message and support your mission across the Printerverse. Let’s work together, bring the right people together, and move the industry forward together. Link in the show notes. Engage long and prosper.
[EPISODE CONTINUED]
[0:12:44] DC: Yeah. I mean, they don’t want to buy print. They want more customers in their business. They want more people at their events. They want to communicate about a new product, or a new business, or a new opportunity for an existing client. I agree with you a thousand percent on that. Can you review some of the features and resources that you are offering on the platform, especially the training programs, and who can offer them?
[0:13:09] SG: Yeah. There’s a whole bunch. I think there’s about 24 videos based on just sales alone, from identifying your target market, to the problems you solve, to how to start a cold call, to the common objections. We’re trying to handle a bit of everything. I’ve also had Matt come in as he’s completely knows nothing about the print industry. It’s actually quite good to get someone that’s not from the industry to bounce some ideas around as well because he does ask, why do you guys do that, or why would you care about X, Y, Z?
He’s also quite big on all the latest, I call them tech tools because I think they are tools. They’re not going to save your business, but he’s very big on the AI and how to utilize the likes of ChatGPT and etc., to get into your business. There’s a few videos and articles about that as well. I think if you went through the 24 videos as a newbie, I think you’d be so far advanced from where you were before you started them. Because basically, it is everything that I’ve learned over 20 years, put into a 24 one-minute video. If you’ve got a spare, say, hour to sit down and watch them and take notes, I think, obviously, I made them, but I think if I got to watch something similar, I would be so stoked.
[0:14:27] DC: Yeah. I mean, definitely. I can understand why you have an ejection, or a skepticism over the ChatGPT influence in sales, and there’s a lot of it. I can see it in my LinkedIn direct messages. I’m like, oh, my God. I mean, at this point now, in the beginning, I couldn’t tell. Now, it’s so easy to tell when it’s – there’s definitely a formula to the way that it tells a story. Back to school, like there’s a beginning, a middle, and an end. Let’s repeat the premise as we are going along, so there’s things. But it is being used by people, so I think ignoring it doesn’t serve the community. I mean, sometimes you have to serve the community with things that they need and not what you want. Would you agree with that?
[0:15:19] SG: Oh, 100%. I think, like any tool, social media, anything, you’ve got to be able to offer authenticity and a bit of, you got to put your own swing on things. I think even, I say this in all the videos where I’m saying like, this isn’t how I would open a cold call with a new client. These are the questions I’d asked. They are the questions. You’ve got to make it work for yourself. Because if you’re not authentic, if you don’t sound authentic, then no one’s going to take you seriously, because they’re going to – if you sound like you’re reading a script, you sound like you’re reading a script, no one’s going to be interested, to be honest. I think it was Bruce Lee or something that said like, “Take the knowledge, make it your own,” kind of thing. It’s 100%, 100% what you’ve got to do, and with any tool.
[0:16:00] DC: I’m going to go back to my suggestion to the Ask Deborah Corn for unsolicited suggestions part of the podcast. Because you said something that is really important about how you wish you had this resource when you were starting. I think that that is so true and reflective of the situation that most young salespeople find themselves in, in which they get a job, whether it’s an entry-level job, or maybe they sold something, I don’t know, they telemarketed, or they sold something, but now they’re selling print and there’s maybe some big-ticket customers out there. It’s almost like, it’s like, there’s your chair, there’s a phone, see you later. That is not very helpful, especially to younger people who don’t function in the world, like me, like a Gen Xer did. Yes, we were thrown into a job and that was it. Figure it out, or get out of here. Those were the options. You figured it out, or you got fired. Things don’t really work like that now.
If you look at the millennials and the Gen Zers, I think that they truly feel that the internet is part of their learning experience on how to tackle life and their careers. Having content that can help people with the 101 of sales, I think would be super valuable. You’d probably get a ton of traffic, which is how you could attract the more seasoned professionals to come in and help you with the younger people. Thoughts on that?
[0:17:37] SG: Oh, a 100%. That’s pretty much what I’ve had in my head. Yeah, you’ve just said that beautifully of probably what I’ve been trying to think in my head. Yeah, I think it’d be great for people because there are sales videos on YouTube for that, but they don’t have that print vibe and they don’t have the, this is the question I ask and this is why for the print part of the equation. That was what we were trying to bring together, the sales advice with the, I’ve been doing the print for 20 years. You need to learn the basics, but don’t get over – don’t swing the pendulum too far the other way and start only talking about your quality and stuff like that, or how you’re going to print out. We’re going to offset print it. We’re going to screen print it, then we’re going to – because no one cares. They just want it to look perfect. You’re trying to, just trying to get that balance, I suppose right, and that’s what we’re trying to do with the platform.
[MESSAGE]
[0:18:35] DC: News from the Printerverse delivers topical sales and marketing insight along with plenty of printspiration one time a month to inboxes everywhere. Our contributors cover the industry and the future of print media and marketing with strategy for strengthening your customer relationships, better targeting of your prospects, and practical advice for helping your business grow. Printspiration is just a click away. Subscribe to News from the Printerverse at printmediacentr.com. Print long and prosper.
[EPISODE CONTINUED]
[0:19:10] DC: I actually have noticed a shift in that the younger salespeople are doing way better with prospecting in sales through social media than the more seasoned professionals who just use it as a, “I sent you information, and why aren’t you buying something from me?” Versus the younger people who are creating relationships. Recently, you actually sent an email from Print Tribe, which comes to my inbox and is very helpful in me trying to figure out sales for my own company, where you focused on social selling versus prospecting. Can you elaborate more on that?
[0:19:49] SG: Well, as I said, social selling, I see as a tool. People can get a platform and they can put information out there and show the work they’re doing and do all those things. It’s also a long game. You’ve got to be willing to spend a lot of time and dedicate a lot of time. You’re not going to pick up your dream – well, I won’t say it definitely won’t, but it’s unlikely, you’ll pick up your dream client within two or three posts, put it that way. You’ve also got to be able to sell and you’ve got to be able to prospect. I see social selling as more as marketing. They might bring someone to your door, but you’ve also got to be able to verify that they’re actually going to be a good client for your print business.
I know with my business, obviously, we have cool clients as I said, like Moët & Chandon and Veuve. The work we do is beautiful and cool. If you put something out there, occasionally we’ll get a woman that sees it. She’s like, “I want you to do my wedding invites.” We’re like, “That’s not our cool business. You should go over and see these people that are better at.” Because as much as it’s good at bringing people in, I think the key with any business is knowing when to say no. There’s always more opportunity than resource and you need to dedicate your resources.
Our resources go towards the larger businesses, small marketing teams. We try and say no to most people outside of those. I think, yeah, people need to know about that for their business with the selling. That’s where I separate those two things, if that makes sense.
[0:21:18] DC: It totally make sense. You told me that one of your goals with Print Tribe is to help a thousand print salespeople add an extra $100,000 in sales, I guess, each year. I’m thinking that you meant each year.
[0:21:33] SG: Oh, yeah.
[0:21:34] DC: Well, I mean, extra is doing a lot of heavy lifting in that goal, right?
[0:21:39] SG: Oh, 100%. It’s definitely extra.
[0:21:42] DC: I don’t want to interject my thoughts before I hear yours, but I do have a lot on that statement. Tell me what your goal is to help members do that.
[0:21:52] SG: We want to get members, as I said, to get really, really clear on who their target market is and the problem they solve and then move them through that sales process, so that they know, okay, this is our target market. We’re really, really clear on that. I mean, what industry are they in? What position in the business are those, the person making the decision likely to be in? How old are they? Because once you know that, you can target your social media towards that. You can focus your other tools towards that. Because again, like I said, only limited resources. Then the problem they solve and how do you articulate that and then how do you start contacting these people and move them through that process.
I think if you can get really clearly to find out that, the number at the end becomes a little bit easier. It depends what business you’re in. If you’re in a small little digital shop, a 100 grand might seem a lot and might be a little bit harder. But if you’re in a larger organization, you might be able to pick up one job that’s 100 grand. It’s just, I suppose that was our goal. It is more just teaching people that sales process, getting really articulate about what they do, the problem they solve, and who they solve it for would be our ultimate goal.
[0:23:10] DC: In a recent Print Tribe email, you wrote, “You don’t create motivation, you align with it.” Can you elaborate on that and how it’s related to sales?
[0:23:22] SG: How I would align that with sales would be, you can’t convince someone to do something they don’t want to do. You can’t just say, “Hey, look. I do printing. You should come print with us.” You can’t give them all the reasons. It’s why I don’t believe in the benefits and features and benefit selling. You can’t say, “We do –”
[0:23:43] DC: You mean, you don’t believe with, we have the best price, the best quality and the best service? What do you got coming up, Deb? You don’t believe in that?
[0:23:50] SG: 100%. No, no, we don’t believe in that, because you sound – It’s strange, because everybody says that, and I still to this day get at least, I don’t know, a call a month –
[0:24:00] DC: I have 10 emails right now with that exact phrase.
[0:24:04] SG: Yeah. Yeah, we’ve got great quality, we have great service, so is everyone else. Now, what problem of mine are you solving? That was where I went back to people buy, because you understand them, not because they understand you. To be clear, I would try and figure out, as I said, we can’t convince them to move over with us. It’s like, well, I know the problem that I can solve, so do you have that problem? Then as I said, once you can figure out if they have it, you can work together and align with your client to solve that problem and move them through the process. Hopefully, that ends with them paying you some money.
[MESSAGE]
[0:24:44] DC: Like what you hear? Leave us a comment, click a few stars, share this episode, and please subscribe to the show. Are you interested in being the guest and sharing your information with our active and growing global audience? Podcasts are trending as a potent direct marketing and educational channel for brands and businesses who want to provide portable content for customers and consumers. Visit printmediacentr.com, click on podcasts, and request a partner package today. Share long and prosper.
[EPISODE CONTINUED]
[0:25:17] DC: When I was a print buyer in advertising agencies, I used to get annoyed with anybody who would call me to talk about my pain points, my pain points, my pain points. Because as we mentioned before, most of the time I didn’t realize I had them, because I didn’t know there was a better way of doing it. When it came to better price, better quality, and better service, I always found that insulting. You’re telling me, I can’t choose vendors and I should believe you that you’re better than all my other vendors. How do you even know who they are? They’re not listed anywhere. I’m sure if you’re a good prospect, you do know something like that.
There’s something to understanding what people are currently doing and giving them an opportunity of having a conversation on how they can improve upon it. I don’t think that there’s anybody who’s not interested in how they can approve. Nobody wants to change, right? Nobody wants to make a change, but they want to make an improvement. I don’t want to talk to you about changing my vendors, putting you in my system, like you’re going to replace anything. But I am willing to talk to anybody who says, “We can help you improve your results. We can help you improve your open rates,” assuming that they know that they might be in jeopardy, or –
[0:26:35] SG: 100%.
[0:26:36] DC: – just improve on them. Now I’m like, huh, we just had a 60% response rate to something. You want to get me 70%? Let’s talk about it because that only makes me a champion with the people I serve. Along the same lines with your philosophy, my philosophy is that a sale is when a need and a relationship meet, which goes back to everything that you’re communicating through your platform, that it’s not just about, I gave you a link, or I gave you a value proposition all about me. Now, you should just be wanting to buy things from me. It goes back to the overall philosophy, I believe that Print Tribe is trying to communicate, and those are the types of people that you want to wrangle, collaborative people.
[0:27:29] SG: Yeah, collaborative people and people that are willing to learn. As I said, I can’t force you to do anything. But if you’re interested in learning something new, if you are new to the industry and you’re thinking, yeah, like you said, I’ve only been given a phone and a laptop and a desk, come check out the platform and hopefully, there’s something there that will benefit you. It definitely gives you the basics. It definitely takes you through the process. Yeah.
I think to go back to what you said, you can’t convince someone to change vendors. I’m like, we’ve got clients and we like it if someone else calls in on them in a print company who can do it probably a lot cheaper than us because they’re not adding a margin. We like it when they say, “Hey, look. We’ve already got Shane and the Cassette crew and they’re doing a great job.” I hope that’s the truth. Everyone out there would hope their clients say that about them. When a client does say that you’ve already got a supplier and we’re happy, it’s probably true. You do have to try and navigate that and figure out a better way.
[0:28:32] DC: I couldn’t agree with you more. I want to thank you so much for your time. Everything you need to connect with Shane, with Cassette, with Print Tribe are in the show notes. Until next time, everybody, print long, sell long, and prosper.
[END OF EPISODE]
[0:28:49] DC: Thanks for listening to Podcasts From the Printerverse. Please subscribe, click some stars, and leave us a review. Connect with us through printmediacentr.com, we’d love to hear your feedback on our shows and topics that are of interest for future broadcasts. Until next time, thanks for joining us. Print long and prosper.
[END]
